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Topic: The Current Plan, So Far... (Read 7427 times) previous topic - next topic

  • JackDaniels
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The Current Plan, So Far...
Ok this is more than likely going to be the Primary Thread from the Moderator's and other Staff Members to make some quick notes and share what we have come up with So Far.

Current Military and Strategy Plan: Recon
As for right now the Primary Focus is going to be for Recon and Scouting of the Vanduul Territories.

During the Attempts of Recon we will have certain Forward Aid Positions to help assist Recon pilots in their duties to scouting and mapping out the Territories. These MFAP's* will be configured to assist Squads doing recon by having a Fuel Ship, Re-arming/Repair Ship, and S&R team on stand-by for any potential issues that may occur during the scouting run's.
*JD's Personal Note: Given to calling the Forward Aid Positions MFAP (Mobile Forward Aid Positions)

MFAP (Mobile Forward Aid Positions): WIP
Still waiting to get more word from CIG on Medical ships, and other Mechanics of certain ships, yet to be released. But, so far the plan worked out by Sailor & Jackdaniels is that each MFAP will consist of ships for these key roles.
•   Refueling
•   Salvage
•   Repair
•   Medical
•   Rearming

With these Key Roles covered at any given MFAP, other pitchfork members can assist or aid in filling in potential roles that could be lacking for a Joint Effort for a little quick rally point before heading off on missions or to fall back to after combat. The key locations of these MFAP's will primary be located at each system JP, and then advance further into the system as the situations will warrant if needing more MFAP's to cover the Logistics and Supply required for all members of the units in systems.

The Battle Plan
Currently Drafted plan of attack till recon is completed. We will be setting up MFAP locations for assault, into Tiber, Caliban, Orion, Virgil, Vendetta, and Vul Ture as needed. Each system may be be targeted by separate organizations in Joint Efforts/Assault's. The attempt to the Capturing of any Vanduul Manufacturing areas will be a Secondary Objective to Securing Systems (Yet Unkown).

After PU Launch

We will be setting up Defensive lines and outpost to Defend Earth, and the Territories that we have managed to capture. From the current listings of launch of the PU there is talk of the Sacking of Earth, we will also be acting as the defense force to defend earth and calling in all pilots to this event in the PU. This will be the all or nothing Event for the full release of Star Citizen and the PU going with the full release.

Blue on Blue
At any time during combat, others that are met with a case of Friendly Fire we have this in effect to handle any Blue on Blue actions. Link: "Blue Fire" Response Protocol Proposal


Note: This is just what the General Guideline of what we have on the table for now. Plans are bound to change, but these are the current Plans and Concepts we are looking to for right now.

If you Feel I have missed something please comment below and I will get this post Modified to cover current Plans and Details that have been confirmed for Pitchfork Operations.

Note 2: I will be keeping this Topic as a Top moderated Topic so anything not related or helpful to the original post will be deleted, in order to help keep helpful Compiled Information available to everyone looking for the data.
  • Last Edit: March 12, 2014, 09:53:05 PM by JackDaniels
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  • Bzerker01
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Re: The Current Plan, So Far...
Reply #1
Regarding Recon, should there be a set of procedures for how recon is to be handled? the size of recon teams or some kind of ratio for escort scout fighters to protect the data retrieving ship, if at all?  Even if there isn't a hard and fast number might there be a suggested number?  If not that is fine but even a suggestion might be nice so that the MFAPs can prepare for certain consistent numbers of ships for refit, refuel and medical treatment.  It may be hard to set up a MFAP with no idea the amount of potential wounded ships and personnel they may have to treat at a given time.
  • Last Edit: March 20, 2014, 09:01:57 PM by Bzerker01

Re: The Current Plan, So Far...
Reply #2

Regarding Recon, should there be a set of procedures for how recon is to be handled? the size of recon teams or some kind of ratio for escort scout fighters to protect the data retrieving ship, if at all?


Not to my knowledge, though I could be wrong. I think a good chunk of the recon stuff needs to wait until we know how sensors work, especially over long distances.

Conceptually, though, I can think of two types of recon:
1.) A stealthy, deep recon which uses a small number of ships and depends on stealth to be undetected, and loiter time to gather information. This probably doesn't have much in the way of firepower, because if they're discovered, they're humped.
2.) A "fight for information" shallow recon, which uses active scanners to find stuff, and escorts to make sure they get back to base.

But, by and large, we need to wait for more details. Though, I guess we could start divvying up our recon assets into different kinds of packages....
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  • JackDaniels
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Re: The Current Plan, So Far...
Reply #3

Not to my knowledge, though I could be wrong. I think a good chunk of the recon stuff needs to wait until we know how sensors work, especially over long distances.

Conceptually, though, I can think of two types of recon:
1.) A stealthy, deep recon which uses a small number of ships and depends on stealth to be undetected, and loiter time to gather information. This probably doesn't have much in the way of firepower, because if they're discovered, they're humped.
2.) A "fight for information" shallow recon, which uses active scanners to find stuff, and escorts to make sure they get back to base.

But, by and large, we need to wait for more details. Though, I guess we could start divvying up our recon assets into different kinds of packages....


Yes thank you that is the general plan is a wait and see for right now... simply because We talked about having 3 different MFAP locations near the Jump Point so as to help with any potential over flow or help with something along the lines of different Squads or wings will be handled by MFAP 1 or MFAP 2 or something along those sorts.

But, as for the Recon I am still on a wait and see that is why I haven't commented much on the Recon thread that was already started in the command room. https://operationpitchfork.com/forums/index.php?topic=227.0

Please if you got a plan I will read it when I can. But, primarily there is very little we can do for right now except get questions answered from the DEV team or wait till we learn more of how the game will handle things.

Notice: Thread Cleaning will happen again soon to help keep the important bits listed. If you feel I have over looked something post a link to it and I or the Moderator's will throw it up into the drafted plans that seem to have the most favor so far.
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Re: The Current Plan, So Far...
Reply #4

Not to my knowledge, though I could be wrong. I think a good chunk of the recon stuff needs to wait until we know how sensors work, especially over long distances.

Conceptually, though, I can think of two types of recon:
1.) A stealthy, deep recon which uses a small number of ships and depends on stealth to be undetected, and loiter time to gather information. This probably doesn't have much in the way of firepower, because if they're discovered, they're humped.
2.) A "fight for information" shallow recon, which uses active scanners to find stuff, and escorts to make sure they get back to base.

But, by and large, we need to wait for more details. Though, I guess we could start divvying up our recon assets into different kinds of packages....


I've worked up a recon plan at https://operationpitchfork.com/forums/index.php?topic=227.msg5274#new


Stage 1: Stealth recon - Ghost Hornets entering enemy systems at random intervals to get fleet strengths, patrol routes, passive sensor data of general info on the force strength in that system. Once they've completed the patrol they will RTB and avoid enemy contact.

Stage 2: Hot Recon - Small, fast maneuverable ships will make visible passes through Vanduul systems. Preferred ships would be M-50's and 350r's for their speed being (potentially) greater than the Scythe based on ship mass and main thruster output. Objectives would be to see Vanduul threat reaction and response times. Ships would be recommended not to engage unless they have to, however waxing a few Vanduul can provide data on their combat skills.

Stage 3: Recon in Force - Squadrons of heavier fighters (325a, Hornets, Avengers, Gladiators) will go into systems already reconed looking for a fight. Would be helpful to have Super Hornets with the recon suite for SWACS duties. These ships are to test Vanduul reaction to heavy combat, specifically their respawn/jump in times for reinforcements and strength of capital ships against smaller torpedo bombers like the Gladiator. Could also have Indris class Frigates and Constellations be part of this recon team to provide heavy fire support and gauge Vanduul reactions to capital ships. Main objective would be to go in, engage, and attempt to provoke a respawn event to see how they will replenish lost units. Once respawn event takes place all ships will need to evac to the jump point.

I'll sit down and work up some numbers for each type later today.
  • Last Edit: April 07, 2014, 04:49:53 PM by GryphonOsiris

Re: The Current Plan, So Far...
Reply #5
I remember seeing that, and thinking it was a solid way of going about it. Granted, for the front-line systems we can do all three, but for the rear-echelon systems (Orion itself, for instance), we will definitely have to rely on stealth recon, and if we're LUCKY we can do hot recon.
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Re: The Current Plan, So Far...
Reply #6
Agreed, the challenge for the rear systems would be crossing the contested front lines and not get spotted, caught or blown to atoms.

I've been doing some thinking based on system size, force presence, recon coverage, ect regarding the patrols and number of shipped required and have come up with the following.

Stealth Recon: 4-6 ships outfitted for low emission, low cross section and low visibility. For the Stealth group their presence in each system needs to be low so as not to draw attention. They would need to fly on radio silence (see: use outside VOIP system) and keep their thermal and EM signatures as low as possible by flying slow and possibly without shields.

Hot Recon: 12-16 ships so the majority can fly close to enemy positions spotted by the stealth recon while a hand full can scout other areas looking for jump points, hidden enemy positions, potential staging areas, ect. Their main priority would be to annoy the hell out of the Vanduul but not take any majors risks. This group may want to arm up with slug throwers instead of directed energy weapons in order to put the max amount of power to main thrusters and shields.

Recon in Force: 24-30 fighter class, 3-4 Constellation class ships and 1 or 2 Indris Frigates. This is all about seeing how they fight back, how long it takes for them to bring in reinforcements, capital ship strength, defensive capability. This team is going in to kick the hornet's nest, slag as many as they can but retreat once reinforcements arrive. All ships will need to be jump capable and special care will need to be made by the fighters to protect the heavier ships in this operation. The Frigate(s) will need to have an operations officer coordinating the fighters and other craft so no one gets left behind.

These numbers are preliminary based on estimations I've made so far and are subject to change as we get more data.
  • Last Edit: April 08, 2014, 09:44:24 AM by GryphonOsiris

  • TEUTknight
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Re: The Current Plan, So Far...
Reply #7
This is merely an assumption and I may probably not work but since the Vanduul are supposedly neutral with the Banu perhaps sending 1 banu merchantman (to test if it works) can pass through without being harmed.

The recon in force in my opinion could work well, but it would need to be at least close to friendly territory for a quick retreat as well as some ships for Search and Rescue operations. And since from what I interpreted from the latest 10 for the chairman. We have the possibility to lay booby traps. So while retreating the recon force can drop these traps to slow and damage the pursuers.

Another option could be to set up the recon in force as a diversion. Not only would the still be able to obtain its goals but it would allow other smaller recon forces to slip in elsewhere while the Vanduul are busy attacking the Recon in Force.

Re: The Current Plan, So Far...
Reply #8
Would also be a good idea to have allies within jump range of the Recon in Force team so if they need to make a hot exit from system they can get fresh fighters to cover them on the way out.

I'm thinking that some of the RIF teams could deploy mines in or near Vanduul positions or along retreat paths to keep them busy during the exfil stage.

  • Viking
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Re: The Current Plan, So Far...
Reply #9



MFAP (Mobile Forward Aid Positions): WIP
[...] each MFAP will consist of ships for these key roles.
•   Refueling
•   Salvage
•   Repair
•   Medical
•   Rearming

[...]

The Battle Plan
Currently Drafted plan of attack till recon is completed. We will be setting up MFAP locations for assault, into Tiber, Caliban, Orion, Virgil, Vendetta, and Vul Ture as needed. Each system may be be targeted by separate organizations in Joint Efforts/Assault's. The attempt to the Capturing of any Vanduul Manufacturing areas will be a Secondary Objective to Securing Systems (Yet Unkown).

(my emphasis)

I'm sorry if I've missed anything, but MFAPs don't seem to contain any attack elements, only support. How are these going to assault anything? And the battle plan seems very thin and written in general terms. Are there more concrete details coming soon?

Master Bacon Maker

Re: The Current Plan, So Far...
Reply #10

(my emphasis)

I'm sorry if I've missed anything, but MFAPs don't seem to contain any attack elements, only support. How are these going to assault anything?


They will not assault anything ;) You can regard the idea of those MFAP's as mobile forward operation bases, that the actual combat units can use as staging area's and to re-arm and repair.


And the battle plan seems very thin and written in general terms. Are there more concrete details coming soon?


I would say probably not before we are in the Beta stage and actually begin to have access to Vanduul systems. While we continue to gain knowledge on the Vanduul and Vanduul systems there is too much we don't know yet. Thus currently we are not able to make very concrete plans, without a lot of guesswork.

There are plans to do extensive scouting and data gathering operations following by statistical data analysis to find Vanduul numbers, strong points and flight patterns. At the same time we need to experiment to assess our own forces in terms of strengths, weaknesses. How far individual fighters can venture on their own rescources, how easy it is to venture into Vanduul space. How the Vanduul respond to incursions and destruction of their assets.

When we know that sort of things we can make more concrete plans :)

Re: The Current Plan, So Far...
Reply #11
Another option could be to set up the recon in force as a diversion.


You and your diversions, TEUT.  :P

As for the MFAPs not having assault elements, this is true. MFAPs won't kill any Vanduul. The ships that refuel, rearm, and repair at the MFAPs will kill Vanduul.
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  • TEUTknight
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Re: The Current Plan, So Far...
Reply #12
Well it was mentioned earlier so I was thinking if we were going to do that plan why can't we have multiple objectives.

Re: The Current Plan, So Far...
Reply #13

Well it was mentioned earlier so I was thinking if we were going to do that plan why can't we have multiple objectives.


Oh we will have many objectives indeed, keep those ideas coming :)

  • Viking
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Re: The Current Plan, So Far...
Reply #14

Oh we will have many objectives indeed, keep those ideas coming :)


The discussion is somewhat fragmented across the forum and hence is difficult to get overview of.

I wrote a proposal earlier with a few keypoints I think is essential, in Xeriar's thread, but it wasn't very popular - on the contrary. The reason I posted it in Xeriar's thread was because it was linked to and spoken of as the most probable/fleshed-out plan so far and I got the impression it was what the leaders of OP was going for.

My basic impression of the discussion here and in other threads in the forum is that people think it's too early to begin discussing a battle plan because a lot depends on the game mechanics. It's true that many things depend on the game, which we don't know how will be yet, but I think we can at least draw up some basic plan(s) anyway. Given the size of this operation, the complexity of details will be equally huge, and so if we wait too long to begin planning then we might end up with a bad plan due to time issues.
  • Last Edit: May 10, 2014, 07:15:20 AM by Viking

Master Bacon Maker

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Re: The Current Plan, So Far...
Reply #15
We don't even have a definitive map of the universe yet, so even route at this point is still speculative. We've been told that the map we're using is pretty close to what RSI has, but that was many months ago and prior to a lot of new systems being added. It's unlikely ALL those systems will be fringe systems so the map is likely to change and so may our route. The plans NEED to be general right now until we actually have some information to go on. Our plans are currently as specific as the information allows and as more information comes in it will become more specific.
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  • TEUTknight
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Re: The Current Plan, So Far...
Reply #16
However, even with a lack of knowledge of game mechanics we can still make an series of plans to test when we can, not to mention formations to try out in the Dogfight Module which will be released soontm.


Re: The Current Plan, So Far...
Reply #17

The discussion is somewhat fragmented across the forum and hence is difficult to get overview of.

I wrote a proposal earlier with a few keypoints I think is essential, in Xeriar's thread, but it wasn't very popular - on the contrary. The reason I posted it in Xeriar's thread was because it was linked to and spoken of as the most probable/fleshed-out plan so far and I got the impression it was what the leaders of OP was going for.

My basic impression of the discussion here and in other threads in the forum is that people think it's too early to begin discussing a battle plan because a lot depends on the game mechanics. It's true that many things depend on the game, which we don't know how will be yet, but I think we can at least draw up some basic plan(s) anyway. Given the size of this operation, the complexity of details will be equally huge, and so if we wait too long to begin planning then we might end up with a bad plan due to time issues.


It is certainly not to early too discuss and brainstorm about battle plans nor to draw up a preliminary basic plan. Provided everyone involved knows and agrees that it can be thrown out of the window with every new release of information. The problem is that it is currently not really possible to make it more detailed than:

Combat unit X (consisting of ships A.B.C.), is coming from system Z to invade system Y and from there proceeds to systems U. While being relieved by ships D. E. and F. so that A. B. and C. can secure system Y and be refuelled and repaired by ships K. and L.

And while it will be difficult enough to even organize A. B. C. D. E. F. K. an L. to perform that task (and that is indeed something to think about in advance) in terms of operational plans it runs into the currently unavoidable barrier of not knowing anything of what pitchfork units will face... Even before jumping to Vanduul space...

We don't know Enemy numbers and assets
We don't know enemy tactics, weaknesses and strengths
We don't know the terrain (beyond in some cases how many planets there are)
We don't know what our operational range is or can be
We don't know how many supplies we need (or how many rescources we need to secure supply lines)
We don't know what kind of unit is effective against the different Vanduul assets (We don't know our own strenghts and weaknesses)
We don't know how the Vanduul respond to incursions
We don't know the Vanduul economy (including spawn points)
We don't know yet how Instances work
Etc, etc

Now that does not mean that people should hypothesize about battle plans, on the contrary they are good thought exercices, especially for the infrastructure we will need outside the main game. Which we can in fact work on already such as:

How do we effectively organize such a great number of players
How do we communicate during the invasion
Do we want some sort of central coordination and planning
Etc, etc.

Luckily there is still time ;)

Re: The Current Plan, So Far...
Reply #18

However, even with a lack of knowledge of game mechanics we can still make an series of plans to test when we can, not to mention formations to try out in the Dogfight Module which will be released soontm.


True I would suggest practicing as soon as able. The Vanduul horde mode will let us know how our ships fare against the Vanduul, other modes might learn us cooperation.

The first iteration of the Beta can perhaps already be used to try out a miny mock invasion in friendly space

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Re: The Current Plan, So Far...
Reply #19
Which we can in fact work on already such as:

How do we effectively organize such a great number of players
How do we communicate during the invasion
Do we want some sort of central coordination and planning
Etc, etc.


It's something to start with anyway.

Master Bacon Maker

Re: The Current Plan, So Far...
Reply #20

It's something to start with anyway.


Indeed, also there is already work being done on a report system so that when the Beta goes live we can gather data on enemy ships and possibly track their movements by analyzing it and running statistics. And I have been talking to Zuur to see if he can develop a map system that we can use for tactical purposes (his plans for his map 2.0 sound really good).

What we also already potentially could do is try to run inventory on the participating organizations and such...

Re: The Current Plan, So Far...
Reply #21
we can also use explorer ship in recon ( mainly for more jump point) like a 315 or a DUR

  • adder
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Re: The Current Plan, So Far...
Reply #22
Hi guys.

I think you are going in a bit wrong direction. Operation Pitchfork is now one of the largest organizations. As such we have capability of striking enemy severely, but what we lack is organizational structure.
See first step is to identify in what time people are playing game and divide them into groups. If I sit with buddy from UK and say lets meet at 7 P.M. tomorrow and kick their behind, then he will log in some 7h after me.
I think you get the picture. We live in 24h time zones, and while We can split groups in generally "3 wings" (Europe CET, Oceania-Asia, Americas) Even among them there is larger time difference. We must start assigning people to 3 fleets and have them get to know each other. When you are in "smaller fleet" of 700-1000 People you can break in CET time squadron based on time you will play. Those people in that group can have one person that will make squadrons and schedules and organize larger actions with heads of operations. People should also know to whom in game they should talk if they by chance have insomnia or vacation so they might participate in operations of other teams. In short:

1. Create structure and have people assign to their global groups.
2. Subdivide these groups to time zones and assign dedicated person for communication within those time zones (if players would like to join temporary to that group that will be a huge advantage to know with whom to talk to).
3. Create squadrons
4. Delegate tacticians to think about operation plans (you need to maintain pressure on enemy for 24/7 to create effect).

Well organized groups and squadrons can make more mess with enemy than having 10 000 people jump into Grinder and try to shoot everything that looks like Vanduul.
Once people start to cooperate you can make ranks and groups. Then when you have that structure, you can say how much assets you have for constant pressure. We are mob. If I have repair ship I might lend it to person A but not to anyone else. That is how you can make assets count and stretch where we are thin (tow ships, destroyers carriers, medi ships).

Once this is dealt with you can start planing operation from taking ground in friendly systems (Like Garron)
Having advanced and strong forces just behind jump gate in Vanduul territory, and mapping and scanning enemy system. Once you hold jump point to system from friendly system with strong force, you might be able to push and block all jump points to a certain system. and then eliminate forces within. Step after that will be much harder because you need to split combat assets into guarding jump nodes from vanduuls. Without this we will not be able to succeed in our goal.
And that is all in case you can jump in system just through jump node, and I doubt that.
  • Last Edit: October 02, 2014, 11:38:12 AM by adder

  • TrItOn
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Re: The Current Plan, So Far...
Reply #23
Step 1: Recon
Ok, MFAP (Mobile Forward Aid Positions) noticed that the locations for such...unknown Vanduul systems (Caliban) for example.....shouldn't the first step of recon to get our ships and MFAP stations into position/s (Nul system) recon then move forward?
and, @Viking :
our MFAP will have it's own Attack wing devoted to protection of any ships 'coming in hot with persuit'. We don't want our ships being refueled and rearmed having to shoot at something while we're setting them up! We will be protecting our "Safe zone"! Hopefully, enough will get on board for this and we will have enough fighters with us to send forward support as well!

NM, just caught the wording when re-reading it...question answered! You will be doing just what i questioned. sorry.
Thanks
  • Last Edit: December 12, 2014, 03:15:27 PM by TrItOn
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Re: The Current Plan, So Far...
Reply #24
Do we have an idea about how comms work. Things like Tactical Frequency, Radio 1 (Squadron Units), Radio 2 (Base, ATC, AIRBOSS.) Incorporating military comm discipline into TeamSpeak. Have we figured out whether we are going to use TeamSpeak vs. Mumble in conjunction with SC VoiP?